Fitness and Nutrition in Managing CF

**Caleigh (Host):**
Welcome to our Fight to Breathe, a podcast rooted in resilience, community, and the power of storytelling. My name is Caleigh Haber and I'm so glad you're here. I was born with cystic fibrosis, a progressive, genetic, rare disease that affects the lungs and digestive system. I've undergone two double lung transplants, spent years navigating the healthcare system, and I've lived through moments I wasn't sure I'd survive. But through it all, one thing has kept me going community. The fierce, brilliant and brave voices of others who know what it means to fight for every breath. This podcast was born from that fight.

Our Fight to Breathe is a space to elevate the voices of people living with chronic illness, disability, and rare disease. It's a space where we talk about the realities of what we face. The triumphs and the grief, the injustice and the joy, the medical complexities and the very human stories behind them. Each episode will feature guests from all corners of the CF and medical world, from patients and caregivers to healthcare professionals and advocates. Together, we'll explore not just what it means to survive, but what it means to truly live. My hope is that you'll walk away from each episode feeling seen, understood, and a little less alone. Whether you're navigating this life yourself or you're here to learn, listen, or support someone you love, this podcast is for you. Thank you for being here. Let's keep fighting together.

Today's episode focuses on the transformative power of fitness and nutrition and managing cf. We'll explore how tailored exercise routines and balanced nutrition can improve overall health, mental well being and quality of life for those living with cystic fibrosis. Our goal today is to empower you with practical strategies and inspiration to foster a lifestyle that nourishes both your body and mind.

As always, our mission with Our Fight to Breathe is to provide a platform for voices in the CF community to be heard, creating a space of belonging and support. Each episode highlights the strength, resilience and hope that defines our community while offering actionable advice and shared experiences.

Now, let's jump into the episode.

I'm thrilled to introduce our guest, Ben Mudge. Ben is a fitness coach, cystic fibrosis advocate, and author of the upcoming book *Fitness Without Limits*, set to release on New Year's Eve. Born and raised in Northern Ireland, Ben was diagnosed with cystic fibrosis at three days old. He has faced a range of challenges, his biggest being GI complications. But he's used his journey to inspire others to take control of their Health.

Ben's philosophy is simple, yet profound. *“Imperfection will always perfect intention”*. Through his dedication to fitness and well being, Ben has built a platform to help others with cystic fibrosis embrace their potential.

Well, thank you so much for being here. And on a personal note, I really, really had a great time chatting when we talked before this and getting to know each other because I've been following you for so many years.

So what I found interesting was our similarities in how our upbringing was around fitness and nutrition and how our parents sort of made it a vital, essential part of managing cystic fibrosis. So if you wouldn't mind introducing yourself to our listeners and sharing a little bit about why fitness is such a large part of your life.

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
Of course. Thank you so much for having me. First of all, my name is Ben Mudge. I am 34, which I had to actually think about what age I was for a second there. I have cystic fibrosis, obviously, and I am a coach. I'm an online coach and I have been coaching now for I'll be going into my 13th year of personal training, online coaching.

I've done some, some pretty cool things. My life has been a bit of an adventure. In fact, this last year I finished writing my own book, which I've got sitting right beside me. So that's been my big, big accomplishment this year.

**Caleigh (Host):**
Congratulations, by the way.

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
Honestly, the introduction to me, 34 years old, I live in Belfast, Northern Ireland. I've been coaching for nearly 13 years now.

And as you mentioned at the top there, fitness has been health, being healthy. I think that's a better way of putting it because I think when you say fitness, it automatically, I think when you say fitness rather than health, I think a lot of people almost switch off because I'm not a fitness person. But I think that's the incorrect way of looking at it. It's, well, you want to be a healthy person. I think everyone agree that being healthier is not something that people don't want.

So I think it's a better way of putting it is health and the prioritization of my health has been something bred into me. And you know, as you said as well, my parents had a huge role in that from when I was a child. So yeah, hopefully that gives people an idea of who I am.

**Caleigh (Host):**
You're already doing it. Like when we spoke before, you had so many just comments that were so quotable and I feel like this is already one that's like changing my perspective because I wouldn't say I have a negative attitude around fitness. But at the moment, it is very hard for me to stay motivated. It's especially hard for me to even understand how to work out right now because I've been so far removed of it. Being bedridden, having multiple surgeries, it's just different for me. I can't just slam my body down because my body hurts. I'm in constant pain. So I have to like, adapt to it.

And you saying that changing the word fitness to health and prioritization around health as a whole is so eye opening for me to already be like, “okay, what can I do?” “What can I do more?” “How can I change my lifestyle?”. So I am excited for this conversation to just continue. And you keep sharing.

You did mention also that your dad was in the military and he has a military background and he was sort of the person that taught you a lot about the importance of posture and how posture is so essential for lung health.

And again, it's my worst thing. I mean, I cannot count the amount of times a day that I am sitting or standing or doing something and my husband actually walks behind me and just taps me on the back because I think he understands that I'm a bit annoyed about like posture, posture, posture all the time. So now he's just like, tap, tap.

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**

Non verbal.

Yeah, like, and it's like a boop. And so, I mean, I don't hold it. And I think that does have a lot to do with just back muscles and working out and things around that.

But for our listeners, can you explain why posture is so important for individuals with cystic fibrosis and how it can improve our lung function?

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
Yeah, of course. So my dad's understanding of cystic fibrosis, whenever I was born, my mum was a nurse. So again, I just want to say very quickly at the top here, I don't like using the word luck. I think luck is a, it just dismisses a lot of hard work that people can't see. So people go, oh, he's so lucky. Because of this, I don't think luck truly exists. There's one aspect that I admittedly do hand over luck to being like, okay, that was pure luck. And that was being born to my mum and dad. You know, the fact that my mum was a nurse, my dad had a fantastic understanding of physical fitness. I mean, you don't pick who you're born to. But that, in my opinion is, that was just blind luck.

So my dad's understanding of cystic fibrosis was okay, well, it's a respiratory illness. If someone slouched over, you know, I'm slouching over here if you can't see me. But if someone slouches over and tries to take a big deep breath, it's like bending a straw. I always think that's the way I always visualize things. If you bend a straw, the airway is not going to clear. It's not going to be a clear shot from through the straw. So my dad was like, okay, well, if he stands up tall, good posture, shoulders back, he's going to have much clearer airways than he would if he was slouched over. And constantly, you know, in this bad posture. That was. That was one of the very, very simple things.

In fact, the funny story is, is that that effect that my dad had on me in regards to my posture, my friends used to take the mick out of me all the time because that transferred to everything I did. My friends always used to make fun of me for the fact that because my dad corrected my posture from such a young age that it just became natural for me that when we were out riding our bikes around the local area, they would all be like, slouched over, looking all cool in their BMXs and I'd be like, upright. They always said I'd look like a dad taking his kids for a ride because I was just so bolt upright on my bike that I just looked like a father. So, yeah, the posture thing helped. It also helped my friends, yeah, take the mick out of me a little bit.

But I said, my dad's understanding of it was that simple, that if he's got good, strong, you know, posture, it's just going to make breathing that much easier for him. And again, it's a very simple, small thing that I think a lot of people, they just forget about it. And in terms of reminding yourself, you know, as you said, you know, you do find yourself sledging back down again. I do that too. But it comes down to just. It's a habit. My habit is to reset my shoulders. Now, do I do that all the time? No, you'll. I'm sure you will, at some point catch me sitting with my shoulders slunched. And that's fine. Slouch. Sorry. And that's fine. But as long as you're remembering to do it from time to time, like your husband just coming and poking you in the back.

But what I would say is if you can have some form of visual reminder to remind yourself that when you see that thing. Oh, okay. I'm going to sit up straight. So I always use like something visual. Like if you put on a bracelet, when you put on that bracelet, say when I look at this, I'm going to remind myself to sit up straight. So it's always about looking for the small ways that you can improve anything you're doing.

What I would suggest is have the, “if not, then what”? Mentality of okay, well if I can't do this, what can I do? So can you go out for a walk? Can you make smarter decisions when it comes to nutrition? Because health, I think when you say fitness, and this is kind of what I was alluding to, when you say fitness, I think a lot of people then go the gym or going for a run or strenuous activity. Whereas I think if you put it in the category of health, that involves mental health, that involves digestion health, that involves sleep health, that involves hydration, that involves just, you know, so many aspects of health that aren't going to the gym. Going to the gym is fantastic, don't get me wrong, but it's such a small percentage of what I would consider health to be. There's so many other things that you know will help you live a healthier life that don't involve you going to the gym.

The worst thing you could do is try and get yourself back in to where you were previous because your, your body is going through a period of stress, trying to deal with whatever illness you've got or recover from whatever bug you've got. Going to the gym, you're adding stress. That's what you're doing. When you go to the gym, like when you're, when you're in the gym, the whole purpose of that is to stress the body into a position where it goes, this sucks. Let's get better at this. So going into the gym when you're sick or trying to recover, knowing how to do it is really important. So making sure you're building yourself up slowly, that's the most important thing.

**Caleigh (Host):**
No, it's great because I, I do that myself. I think fitness and it's like going to the gym or going for a run or doing something on the extreme where the way that you're saying about hydration, walking, just eating right, all those boxes, I feel like I'm checking. I'm just pushing myself a little bit more because I do walk now living in the city again, I walk a lot with my dogs. I'm probably walking five plus miles every day. So, yeah, overall you're changing my outlook on fitness and I think it's actually making me a little more comfortable to feel like, okay, yeah, I don't have to go on that extreme and feel like I have to go to the gym. I can just do something really simple here at home, maybe yoga, maybe stretching, maybe a little bit of using my own body weight to do something. So thank you very much.

And I know fitness now is the cornerstone of your CF management, and it's inspired you not only to prioritize it in your life, but also help others. So what made you sort of fall into this route of becoming a coach?

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
That's a good question. So my. My initial passion in life was to be a director. I wanted to be a film director. In fact, I actually studied for four years to be a director and then started working in the film industry over here in Northern Ireland. And I was very fortunate enough to get a couple of jobs. It gave me a really good taste of what a potential future for me might look like. I was very fortunate to work on the first season of Game of Thrones. This is before anyone. Yeah, before anyone really cared about it. To me, I was like, oh, this is cool. It's a big budget, it's hbo. It's, you know, it's a huge production. But it didn't have the fanfare that it has obviously now or did have. So it was actually working on that set.

And what I very quickly realized working on those sets was everything that I needed to prioritize for my own health got pushed down the list of priorities. And that's something that I talk to my clients all the time about. And anyone who listens to me, to be honest, health and fitness will never be the number one priority in most people's lives, unless you're a professional athlete or professional bodybuilder. It's always just going to be as high up that priority list as possible. Because unless you're getting paid to go to the gym, which not many people are, unless you're, as I said, professional athlete or a bodybuilder, things will come first. Paying for your house, paying for food, having a roof that go over your head. So these are all the things, your relationships, all those things are going to come above going to the gym and your health and fitness. Unfortunately, it's just the way it is.

For example, when you get sick, boom. Recovering from that sickness pushes fitness down a little bit more. Things are always going to come in and challenge the list of prioritizations of things you've got going on in your life. So it's all about trying to make sure that you're pushing up as high as you can.

And that's what I realized when I was working on those sets, that it was getting pushed further and further and further and further down that list to the point where I really didn't feel comfortable. And, in fact, to the point where it actually caused me to be hospitalized for the second time with a chest infection.

So it was on working on those sets, I was already thinking, what can I do from here? What options do I have? And I was talking to Dothraki, which was one of the warriors. He was an extra. And I asked him, “What's your job? How are you free during the day to do this?”. And they're obviously all in great shape because they're warriors. And he said, I'm a personal trainer. That sparked off that conversation, and it's speaking to him that I realized, hey, this is actually something that I might be interested in.

Because at that point, I'd been training for a while, I'd started to see changes in my body that I genuinely never thought I would see. My doctors and all told me that, look, building muscle is going to be more difficult for you. They kind of tempered my expectations about what I could achieve physically. And then I realized, speaking to this guy, I was like, wait a minute. I can not only prioritize my own health, but I can help other people get healthier, too. And to me, you know, having cystic fibrosis, the idea that I could help someone in my position make their lives better from a health and, you know, health and fitness perspective was incredible to me. The fact that I wouldn't be, my CF would have nothing to do with it. In fact, it would just be a little mini source of motivation for the people I worked with. That, okay, “if. If Ben is doing this, despite all the things he's got going on, maybe there's a chance that I could do this, too”. And that was always my intention. I never try to ram it into people, so, oh, if I can do this, so can you. Because that's a silly statement. Because everyone's lives are so different.

Your relationship with food is different than mine. Your genetics are different to mine. Your family dynamics. There's so many things that just make that a silly statement. It's like the whole 20. Everyone's got 24 hours in the day.

**Caleigh (Host):**
Actually, something that a lot of people with cystic fibrosis and other health issues kind of go through is this pathway of taking on a profession and then either quickly realizing or later realizing that it's not quite the best thing for their health. It's not a good contributor. And so therefore they have to turn to something else and figure out what do I do next?

And so I think that it's really great that you were able to use something that basically was ingrained in you all your life to make a career out of it and now write a book and inspire other people. So it's really motivating.

And especially what you said about just prioritization. When I was younger, I think that this also comes with age. When I was younger, I definitely felt like I was prioritizing my health. I felt like I'm doing my treatments, I'm taking my medicine, that's prioritizing my health. That's it, right? Like, as long as I'm doing everything, checking the boxes of my medical regimen, I'm done.

But what I didn't realize was all the other stuff, the eating, right, the sleeping, all of that, that plays such a big part. And it was only when I went through another decade of life or death that now I've realized how prioritizing health is so important and what that actually means as an overall mind and body.

And you've talked to me a lot about mental health and your journey through mental health. And so what specific ways has fitness positively impacted your lung function, your mental health, and just your overall well being?

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
Again, good question.

So I think mental health and health should just be, they should just be put as one, because without your mental health, you can be the healthiest person in the world, but it doesn't matter.

You know, I've seen these people. Again, this is experience just from, from meeting people whose physiques look like they've been chiseled out of marble. Like they're just ridiculous, incredibly fit people as well. But what I quickly noticed was, despite how you look, it doesn't matter if your head is not in the right spot. The thing I noticed about bodybuilding, and this kind of comes back to your question about has it benefited me? But first of all, I think it's important to kind of take a look at how it could have affected me negatively. I was speaking to these people who, as I said, had these incredible physiques, physiques that you would envy. And when I spoke to them, I realized, oh, you don't appreciate what you've got. Like, they were like, oh, I want to make my arms bigger. I want to make this bigger. This isn't big enough. They were constantly critiquing things that you were looking at going, but your Arms are already huge, your glutes already look amazing, your abs look amazing. Like, it's like they're, they go into this process. Bodybuilding tends to kind of nurture of dismiss all the hard work you've done to always be looking for what you could have more of. And I very quickly saw that that was not a good way of living.

My biceps being half an inch bigger would not have made me happier. Being a little bit leaner wouldn't have made me happier. I've been to a position where I was the leanest I could have possibly gotten for a bodybuilding show. But even then at my leanest, I was still looking at parts of my body going, oh, I need to get rid of this tiny bit of fat. And they very, very quickly realized that's not a healthy place to be mentally.

So I think high bodybuilding has helped me and fitness, let's just say fitness in general has helped me with my, my mental health is. I said this the other day how I physically look. And I'm sure a lot of people, you know, when they look at me and I understand this, they look at me and go, “oh, he must be quite vain” or he likes, you know, because of the way I look. People immediately make assumptions and I get that, that's what we do.

But what they don't realize is that I grew up massively underweight. I was always skinny, I was always a smallest kid. I stood on the sideline while all my friends played rugby. Every Saturday morning with my dad, I stood on the sideline watching all my friends having fun. Yeah, I just always felt like outside of that bubble, because of my physical stature, I was fast, I was good, I was dedicated, I did everything the coaches asked of me. Wasn't enough. I was not big enough, wasn't strong enough to get on the pitch.

So for me, how I physically look now helps me mentally more than anything else. I've never wanted someone to look at me and point me out in a crowd and be like, that's the sick one. So for me, mentally, knowing that my hard work and my dedication and my just, honestly just stubbornness to doing what I've been doing for the last 20 plus years, which is training, it's given me that peace of mind that my physical body is strong, it looks powerful, it looks capable, and I think that's it. I think everyone wants to feel useful and that's what having my physique does for me mentally. It makes me go, okay, first of all, people are never going to point me out as the sick one or the weak one or the weak link or anything like that. You know, if you physically look a certain way, people treat you a different way. CF starts becoming a big thing.

**Caleigh (Host):**
It's true. You don't take it for granted. Definitely you don't take it for granted. You understand you're a realistic optimist. I feel this is maybe just projection, but like this is how I describe myself because any situation I'm in, I like to know all the facts, the good and the bad. That's being the realist. But I also like to look at them from an optimistic mindset. And I think that that manifests, you know, the future for me. And that's how I choose to believe to go into surgeries and hospitalizations and everything. I kind of look at the other side and set small goals for myself that are achievable so that I know when I get out I'm going to go visit my grandma or when I get out I'm going to go do this. Something that's enjoyable for me, that I'm looking forward to and also gives me the motivation to stay on course and keep up the daily tasks that are just sometimes daunting, which can be working out, which can be nebulizers, which can be washing our nebulizers, all of those things.

And you talked a lot just right there about your physical look, you know, how people perceive you. And I think that luckily right now things are shifting in cystic fibrosis. We can kind of become more invisible in this invisible disease. Air quotes. People that are able to gain weight are kind of going more undetected. They're also being able to do more physically like run workout, all of those things.

And for you, you said like it's kind of like a confidence boost for people not to realize that you have cystic fibrosis.

Well, as somebody who went through 15 years of being just absolutely underweight, feeding tube oxygen, looking ill, you know, I feel like now on the other side of it, I have gained weight. I'm not the most fit as I would like to be physically, but I would say that I look past it because I'm able to do more. Which somebody with cystic fibrosis, if people don't know this, are actually required to have a higher BMI than normal because the doctors want to give a buffer for us to be able to get sick and lose a little bit of weight and it not to become life threatening or not to put us in a position cushion of then spiraling downward so that extra cushion, I guess you could say, is a positive. And I have that extra cushion. I would, I think, now. But the way I look at it is like, okay, well, maybe I don't feel like I look perfect in my mind, which, again, is one person's opinion in this world. Right.

But look, I'm able to hike, I'm able to snorkel, I can swim, I can keep up with people.

In fact, something that I think I spoke about in another episode is that when I meet people now, they don't bring up me being sick because they don't know.

Maybe they'll see a scar and they'll ask what a scar is. Possibly, maybe. But nobody even can identify me as having cystic fibrosis or a transplant or actually, the first thing they see is my, oh, I don't have it on my arms. My bedazzled insulin pump. That's always the first thing. They're like, what is that? It's so cool. But other than that, it kind of goes undetected.

And it is this sort of ego boost, which is kind of weird to admit, but it's like, it makes you feel like the hard work is paying off or, you know, it's like a nod to all that you're doing to stay healthy.

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
Yeah, I think. And I don't know if you. You might agree with this, but I think that we are not our illness. We're. CF is just part of us. Like, you know, what color of eyes do you have?

**Caleigh (Host):**
Brown.

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
Brown. So you have brown eyes. Cool. You've also got cystic fibrosis. It's just part of us. And I think the less attention it gets, the less we think about it, because again, I don't know if you're the same, but mental drain that comes with having cystic fibrosis is immense. My cystic fibrosis, my reality of cystic fibrosis is my reality. So that's all I can speak to.

I understand that it's such a diverse and massively different illness for every individual because of this, its nature, it's genetic. But then you also have to consider their upbringing, their parent, all those things. So all I can ever speak to is my experience.

My experience of it is that the mental drain of having CF is overwhelming. And I think that the more we do that, CF doesn't come up into the conversation, as in how we physically look, all those things. If it's brought up over and over and over again, it's going to be part of your thought process more regularly, which makes sense. So I think that the physically better we feel, the less we think about it. The less we think about it, the more time we've got to think about other things that we care about.

**Caleigh (Host):**
You can only control what you can control. But in my mind, if I can control all of those factors, to the best of my ability, to the best of my knowledge, that includes educating myself about things that come out, questioning doctors, pushing past the boundaries, all of those things, then when things go out of my control, I can't blame myself. And that does make me feel better, because I just understand not everything is controllable. Therefore, as it comes, as the unexpected arises, you just have to react to those moments and also not think all the way past.

Because I know being in the hospital and waiting for my transplants and all of those things, every single day, there was years, every single day, I was asked a life or death decision, not exaggerating. And people like, how do you. How do you do it? How do you do it? And it's strange because the one thing that I consider myself really good at is just making health decisions, because I'm used to it, because I have the most experience doing it in my life over everything else.

And it's like, because I look at what's happening right now, I take in all the information, I educate myself, and I make the decision based on that, not about what might happen in a year.

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**

Yeah,

**Caleigh (Host):**

because I am looking at, you know, the outcomes of the surgery, like I was saying, the positives, the negatives. But I'm not harping on the one statistic of 2% of people that it goes wrong. I'm looking at what can go right. But on the flip side, I'm also not looking at transplant and thinking like, X amount of people, you know, get a transplant and X amount don't, because that might not be positive either. But I just have to believe that I will in those situations.

But everybody has hard days. How do you deal with those days? How do you deal with, like, maintaining your consistency in your fitness routine despite maybe having a negative day?

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
Another great question. I think you can have great days and you're gonna have bad days. There's positivity, and then there's delusional positivity.

Being a positive person, it's a choice. Like, we choose to be positive, we choose to look at those things. And that's always. That's a decision.

But it doesn't mean that we're delusional. On the days where I'm not feeling good or if I'm feeling stressed, I just simply go, okay, well, first of all, accept it. That's pretty normal. But what's something small that I can do today that despite this being a terrible day, you know, overall in terms of stress or worry or anything like that, just do one simple thing.

So for me, that isn't always training, but on the days where I'm really not motivated to train, you just have to force yourself to do it. You just have to go down and do it. Like people, I think, for the most part, expect motivation to be the thing that gets them to where they want to be. What's going to make you get it done is understanding that, okay, when I do this, I feel this. I like feeling like that. Cool. I'm going to go and do that thing. So motivation plays such a small role in getting the job done. Motivation is like the wind. The wind comes along and for a moment you can go, okay, let's ride these. Ride the. The winds of motivation. You pop up the sail. Boom. You can sit back and you. You can relax. You move pretty quickly, but you know that those winds are going to stop. Eventually the winds are going to stop. You're gonna have to take down the mast, you're gonna take down the sail, and you're gonna get back to the hard work of rowing with your hands again. That's so important. Like, when it's there, capitalize on it, use it, and you're gonna get sources of motivation. Like, you may watch a TV show, you may speak to your friend, you may get a compliment. You may have something that puts your life in risk, and you're like, cool, I need to do something about that. Use that. But when it stops, don't stop. Keep going. This is hard work. Cool. Pat yourself in the back for doing the hard thing that realistically, not many people do.

**Caleigh (Host):**
Do you consider working out or fitness medicine part of your medical routine? It sounds like you do. Yeah.

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
Yeah. Movement is medicine to me. I think the human body was designed perfectly to move. I mean, the more you realize that and the more. The better understanding I've got of the human body. Just from my job, obviously, and then just learning, the more I'm like, this thing is a beautiful, beautiful tool.

Even just walking, just going out for a walk, it's one of the nicest things we can do. So therapeutic. Just go out for a walk in nature. That's where the human species developed from. Like, we lived in the forest, we lived in this, the nature. It's only now, in the last couple thousand years, that we've made homes and stuff, but for the most part, we spend most of our time in nature. So going out for a walk, breathing some fresh air, honestly, some of the best things you can do.

And you know, when we talk about medicine, we always think, oh, tablets and stuff like that. But medicine to me is things that are like force multipliers to your life. Being healthy and fit is a force multiplier to my life because it allows me to do things that I want to do.

Like, if I want to climb up a mountain tomorrow, I'm probably going to struggle a little bit, but I have the physical capabilities of doing that because of all the work I've done previous to that. So, yeah, 100%, I believe that movement is medicine.

You know, I think that's a better way of putting it rather than working out, because again, some people may not work out yet, but that doesn't mean you can't go out for a walk, go out for a cycle, go out for. Even if that is literally going to the mall and walking around the shops.

**Caleigh (Host):**
Like, that's my fitness. I'll go out and I'll, I'll get the miles in. When I'm at the mall or on the street or walking, doing some window shopping, it's like, I'm just, I always say, I text Bryan, I'm like, gone with the wind. It's my expression now to be like, found something great. I'm going to be gone for a few hours. I'm walking, I'm out, like, and it's, it's good because then your mind's distracted from maybe the pain of your body or the stress of your body or whatever it is.

So if you can find that distraction while working out, like hiking, you have a good view or you have a waterfall to get to on a hot day or whatever that distraction could be that can actually benefit this lack of, as your air quoting it. Motivation. Exactly.

So let's shift a little bit to the other side, which is nutrition. And nutrition for cystic fibrosis is one of the most important things in our life.

If you don't have cystic fibrosis or you don't have a close family member or friend with cf, maybe you don't understand that, but it is something that keeps us alive or something that maybe contributes to our decline. Right?

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**

yes

**Caleigh (Host):**

If we're not keeping our weight up, it can decline our lung function. The healthier our nutrition is, the better our health is overall.

I'm a cystic fibrosis diabetic, and after doing research, I've kind of learned techniques for eating better. So for me I do a little bit of like a fiber rich food first and then I go to maybe proteins and fats and, and then I follow that in carbs. And lastly I would possibly do sugars or desserts. Right. And that's sort of just to help slow down the spike of my glucose and help maintain a normalized or more normal glucose for somebody with diabetes.

Can you give a practical tips to help people improve their eating habits and overall nutrition?

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
So I think nutrition is such a complex topic for, for anyone to be honest, CF or not.

And the one thing I always try to remind people of it's the dangers in the dosage with everything. Everything if abused can be poisonous. Everyone thinks, oh, what, like what water? You drink too much water, you can, you can die from being too hydrated. Everything in moderation is the best way of looking at nutrition.

It's very easy to kind of fall into the trap, especially when you start looking at nutrition in more depth like, like I did at the start of my career and almost see food as just fuel. And I think whilst yes, we can all agree that food is fuel and, and the phrase you are we eat is actually far more accurate than people realize. Cells regenerate constantly within the body and the only way those cells can regenerate is from the food that we give it. So literally you are what you eat. If you eat a lot of junk food, your cells are probably not going to be too great. But as I said earlier, like it's, it's all about the danger that is in the dosage.

I think it's really important that we get the balance of what our body needs and requires. So that's like getting enough protein to make sure we're supporting muscle growth and muscle repair. If we are training and just proteins, obviously using a multitude of other things, but that's one of the big ones. Making sure we're getting plenty of fats as well and the right amount of fats to help support our hormones and everything else that's involved there. And then carbohydrates, literally it's just energy. It's the fuel to our, to our machine, this beautiful machine we get to, to rent out for a while. And I think it's important that we kind of, what I always say to my clients is check off all the things that your body needs. What does your body need? Okay. It needs a certain amount of calories. Cool. It needs a certain amount of protein, needs a certain amount of fat, a certain Amount of carbs. And again, those last two, I would argue unless you've got diabetes or something like that, you don't need to overly worry about the percentages of those last two. Just fill up whatever you've got remaining with those two. But once you've checked of all the things your body needs, as in to live a healthy life, start including all the things you want.

Because I think food has so much more to it than just being a fuel. And I think if you look at it as simply a source of fuel, then you're missing out a massive part of what nutrition is. I mean, nutrition is food. Let's just say food, food is such a deep cultural thing for humans. Like when you say getting together, breaking bread, it's literally in that, like, oh, we're getting together and breaking bread. Food has such a meaning to so many cultures, so many relationships. I guarantee there's a. In fact, I actually said this the other day. There's a smell of a, an ice cream. And anytime I smell whatever flavors in the ice cream, I'm immediately transported to being five or six years old with my mum, my dad, my brother and my sister being in Spain. When you go to the cinema, you smell popcorn. Popcorn then makes you think, oh, what was that film I loved? It has so many ties that make it just saying, oh, food is fuel. It's such a, such a silly statement really.

There's no such thing as good or bad foods. They don't exist. Foods don't have morals. I've always said that, you know, broccoli's not going to stand up for you in a street fight and pizza's not going to come and stab you in the back. You can have a pizza, that's absolutely fine. But understand that, okay, if I have this pizza, that means that I'm maybe going to have to pull back some of my calories over the next couple of days to make sure the average is where it needs to be. Simple as that. And also understand that don't put yourself in this unnecessary prison of excluding foods because someone said that they're good or bad for you. Especially now on social media. You see so much nonsense out there.

**Caleigh (Host):**
I was going to say that this is another instance. You're just reading my mind. It's like with social media, we can literally come up with like a million amazing tasting, quote unquote, *healthy foods*. Yeah. That have great protein, great source of fat, great everything with like, moderation and like, you're saying, not putting yourself in a food prison, which I've Never heard before, but hilarious.

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
Again, this is a conversation. I have these conversations like weekly with my clients that if you're going to a wedding, for example, and my client be like, oh, I had this at the wedding, I had this, this. And I'm like, cool, “Was it nice?” “How did it taste?”. And they're like, oh, you're not going to shout at me for having this? And I'm like, why would I shout at you for enjoying a memory? Do you seriously think I'm going to tell you no? You should have brought a Tupperware of fully pre prepared meals so you could sit at a table and look like a loony while you're eating your Tupperware while everyone else is. No, like, let's be realistic about this. You're a normal person. The chances are if you're listening to this, you're not a professional athlete and you're not a professional bodybuilder. I always use those two examples because, because they are the people that, they do have to be a lot more restrictive with how they treat nutrition. Because what was the difference between the guy in first and like eighth and the 100 meter? It was like half a second. So those are the people who are looking for that 0.1% improvement in their diet, in their training, in their nutrition, in their recovery. All those things.

We as normal people, we don't need to be worrying about that. Let's leave that for the athletes and the people who need to worry about that. We don't need to be overly stressed about these minute details.

Any situation where you're trying to improve yourself or challenge yourself or change yourself or grow in any way, it's so important that you believe that you can actually do it. Because if you don't believe it can be done, I've got news for you. Probably not going to get it done.

**Caleigh (Host):**
I think that it's a mindset and a lifestyle and that's sort of the key to staying healthy, is just your mindset is going to the gym. Your lifestyle is going to the gym for you. For other people it might be your mindset is taking a walk or your lifestyle is walking your dogs. For me, that's, that's me, you know. So it is different for everybody and everybody is sort of has different tools in their toolbox to achieve what they can.

And so we, we both definitely recognize that we are so unique. We all have different requirements when it comes to nutrition. When it comes to fitness, we can maybe get away with other things- air quoted - “getting away” with something. And Other people can't.

But, you know, that's, that's life. We are so individual. We are so unique. And that's even in cystic fibrosis, right? Like, even in my own life, I can maybe. I used to be able to get away with eating ice cream in the morning, but I also was on a feeding tube, so all my nutrition came from that. So it's not like it was fun. It was just. That's what I was able to eat. So I ate it. And now maybe I can't get away with eating ice cream every day. And I do. I shift. But, you know, it's. We as humans adapt. And I think it's just the want to adapt, the choice to adapt, the dedication to adapt, all of that.

Well, you've built such a strong online presence, and you're so open about cystic fibrosis. A lot of your account has to do with working out, since you are a personal coach, but you also talk just about CF and being open. Why do you think that is so important for you?

One, being an individual with cystic fibrosis, two, being a male, and three, just being in today's society. What allows you to share your journeys openly?

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
I can. My parents. I think my parents and my upbringing, actually, again, something I speak about in the book, about my. My willingness to be open.

We have the ability to speak. I'm literally making sounds right now that you understand, you can comprehend, and you can think about. The fact that, again, a lot of men don't use that voice and that ability to communicate is devastatingly sad for me. The fact that someone could go, I always say this. I'd rather have an awkward and difficult conversation with my friend than be carrying their casket. I'd rather have that conversation then, yeah, be given the speech at your funeral.

So to me, it's always been that mindset. And I think my dad, you know, is a fantastic person to teach me that. That men should cry.

I have this opinion that, yeah, these people say men can't cry. I actually taught this to my nephew the other day. I was like, “zach, do you cry?” And he's like, “yeah”, I cry. And he's like. I said to him, “you know, that's fine to do that as a boy. And anyone who tells you you can't cry if you're a boy is silly”. And he went, yeah, yeah, yeah.

And I said, my opinion on that is if men aren't allowed to cry, by that logic, we shouldn't be allowed to laugh. And no one's going to say that, oh, men shouldn't laugh. Why? Because. oh, it's letting into, like, it's. It's giving into this emotion. I'm like, laughing and crying. Sometimes crying can come with happiness, immense amounts of happiness. And it's not like we can, like, stop ourselves from crying. It's a natural thing. Like, you don't have to tell yourself to laugh. Crying happens naturally. Laughter happens naturally. It's a human emotion. By locking off one of those emotions, I just think you are. It just makes no sense to me. It's never made any sense to me.

But the part I say about in the book is, and this is a really strange one to realize, but I was watching re watching Lord of the Rings for the 20th time. What I noticed in that film that I'm so grateful for, there was such a huge part of my life growing up because I was such a nerd. Every male character in that, in that franchise, in that, in those films, they cry.

It's something I just firmly believe that sharing your emotions, and again, just me being open, me talking honestly, has made you realize, oh, we have a connection. There's things that you and I both feel.

And I think human connection is one of the most normal and natural desires that humans have. We want to feel like we're part of a community. We want to feel understood. We want to feel like there's someone out there who gets what it's like to exist.

Whenever I started posting about my cystic fibrosis more often, I never wanted to be, “look, he's got cf, look how well he's done”. I wanted to be, “look how well he's done, he's got cf”. I never wanted people to go, oh, it's because you're cf. Look how well you've done. You know, pat on the head, you've done so well. Despite the fact you got cf. It's like, oh, wow, he's done well. Oh, he also has cf. Wow. Okay, that puts that into more perspective. That order of that sentence is so important to me.

And as I said, you know, sharing about my cystic fibrosis, I really quickly realized that it was helping so many people. Despite it not being naturally that comfortable for me, I quickly stopped caring about how uncomfortable it was for me because I saw how comfortable it made other people.

You know, that's ever been said to me is that I give people hope. The fact that I can give these parents who were much like my own parents, I can't imagine how scared my parents were when I was born, when they were told that their child had cf, I can't even imagine. I can't fathom that.

So the fact that me simply speaking about it could save that parent who's in the same situation as my mom and dad were when I was born with their child, it can make them go, okay, so maybe, maybe things are going to be okay for my child.

**Caleigh (Host):**
Do you ever feel a sense of responsibility because of that?

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
Yes. Yes. Huge. I don't really talk about it that much. I talked about it to my very close friends. But yeah, I think the position I'm in, again, very, very grateful for it. But there's pros and cons. I think people can very easily look at me and see me as like a role model. And that's, again, that's their words, not mine. I don't think I'm a role model. I think I'm just a person who's doing what they think is necessary. And very gratefully, again, people then put me into that category as a role model.

At the same time, yeah, it's difficult. Like, I am constantly worried about things I say. I've been attacked on a few occasions for saying the wrong thing. I got shouted out for not knowing every medication that's associated with cf. I didn't know my exact gene mutation because honestly, when I was a kid and going to the CF clinics, it's just part of my life. I just went, blew into some tubes, got some bloods taken, you know, got some magic cream on my hand before they took it. Like that was just my. I didn't question it, I just did it. It was just part of my life.

But it's only when I got older, people were like asking me more about it and I was like, honestly, I don't know that much because my mum took care of it. My mum did everything for me up until a certain age. So, yeah, I always feel like there's a little bit of pressure that comes with being in the position I'm in.

**Caleigh (Host):**
I relate so much and I mean, I didn't plan on asking you that, but I'm just listening to you speak and it's something I relate to because I think when I had cystic fibrosis and I was going toward my first transplant, it was more just sharing connection. Yes. There was definitely people talking to me, asking questions or saying, I've never seen anybody else with cystic fibrosis and now I've seen you and it's helping in some way. And that to me was really eye opening. And the connection there was just really Incredible.

But when I went into organ rejection and I declined at a much faster rate, I mean, very, very rapid, that was the first time that I actually considered that I might die. Which is very interesting, because going into a first transplant, being told I'm going to die, being told I can't get it, then waiting for it, never once did I think, oh, I might die. I just sort of just was living my life. I was much younger, you know, but waiting for that second transplant, I was just incredibly sick.

I was scared to go to sleep. There was many nights I would just not sleep because I refused, because I thought I would die in my sleep. I would ask my husband to stay awake because I was scared that if I stopped breathing, I wouldn't realize.

I mean, it was just so much that on social media, I only show a part of me. I don't show the whole picture. Not because I'm hiding or not because of any reason, but just because that's, I guess, just what I've done.

But that second time, waiting and thinking, you know, I might die and having conversations with my family and all of those things. Like, I was less scared of the conversations about what my family would do after and what my choices were around that. I was less scared of that and more scared of just letting people down, which I felt like letting people down, because they would then not feel that same spark that it's possible in their lives.

And that's absolutely ridiculous. And I fully logically understand that. But, like, the illogical part of my brain is like, there's so many people looking at you that you have to. You don't have a choice. This is, you know, you have to do this.

In some way that is helpful because it gives you a will. It gives you this, like, kick in the butt to keep going. But in a lot of ways, it was. It was hard psychologically for me to just think about that. And that's something I've never shared, I've never talked about. I don't even think I've talked about it with family or friends because it's just not something that comes up.

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**

I appreciate it.

**Caleigh (Host):**

But it is. It's something that's there. But again, like you said, like, the. The pros are so much better because just connecting other people, either connecting with me or me connecting with other people. In this case, I reached out to you. I've seen you so much. I look up to all that you do, staying, you know, in the gym and also helping people and also just being so knowledgeable and dropping bombs, like, every sentence you say is quotable. Like, I honestly, I'm like, I need to just, like, listen to you speak more often because you're so wise.

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
I didn't record the audiobook for my book, so, you know, if you want to. If you want me in your ears, there's a.

**Caleigh (Host):**
Well, that's what I'm. That's what I'm getting. Because, you know, I'm so minimal now because we're traveling so much. So I just tend to do audiobooks. And I do audiobooks throughout the day when I clean the house or when I'm walking the dogs or whatever. So I'll definitely be listening to your voice and while you're reading. Because you read it yourself, right?

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
I did. That was. That was probably the most nervous I've ever been, like, in any. Anything I've ever done. Reading the audiobook for my book was the most terrified I've ever been because I'm dyslexic or some. Some variation of dyslexia. I'm not sure exactly what it is, but I'm me and my mom is like, yeah, you're dyslexic growing up. So reading a book out loud, but not only that, but making it interesting, changing my pitch, changing my cadence, changing the tone. That was terrifying. But my entire approach to that was, you're not going to be good at this because you've never done it. So don't let my ego get in the way. Don't get frustrated, laugh it off and just accept the fact that you're going to suck at this thing.

And I think that's a really important lesson for a lot of people that, you know, if you're thinking about getting into the gym, if you're thinking about picking up a new sport or anything at all, even if it's nutrition, accept the fact that you're going to suck at it to begin with. Please just do that for me.

Because I don't know where people get this ego boost of, like, I've never done that thing. I'm going to be great at it.

**Caleigh (Host):**
Expectations of society, I think. Yeah.

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
Like, so I just accept the fact that I probably wasn't going to be that good at it, but I also accepted the fact that I was going to get better at it the more I did it. So we actually. We recorded the start of it, obviously, the first day. We did it in order. But the guy who's recording it, Nial, just want to give him a shout out because he made the entire process so much more enjoyable for me. He said to me at the very start, you do realize we're probably going to have to go back and record the start of the book again. And I was like, why? And he's like, because you will get so much better as we do this process. And sure enough, we listened back to the first portion of the book after finishing the entire thing and I was just like, oh, that was bad.

So we just recorded the entire first part of the book again after I'd done it all, because it was just so much better. And the start of the book is a little bit more autobiographical as well.

**Caleigh (Host):**
I just want to say one more time. Your book is called *Fitness Without Limits* and it's available on Amazon. That's the easiest place to find it, but you can also find it on Bookshop, Foley's and Waterstones, and it focuses on, on breaking down barriers.

And can you tell us just one more quick thing about your book? Maybe your favorite little insert or anything that you want to add?

We've talked a lot about it and I think just hearing you on this, you can, people can understand and get an eye into, like, who you are as a being. You're so interesting, you're so engaging, you're so knowledgeable.

So again, I personally am so excited to listen to your book and hear a voice in my ear talking about, you know, your life and your perspective on life. If you're more of a book person, get it on Amazon. And there's a hard copy, there's soft copy, you can get whatever you want. It's available now for pre order and by the time this comes out, it's going to be available to probably get to your house next day.

So share anything that you'd like with us.

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
Honestly, this book was written for me when I started, so it's my entire coaching philosophy. The nicest thing that I got from the feedback of it was whilst we're recording the audiobook, the guy who was helping me record it, he was like, there's so much stuff in this book that I can immediately apply to my life right now. And that's all I wanted.

I wanted a book that you can pick up and just immediately start taking action on the things I'm telling you about and we're not diving in so deep that you'll get confused. It's the perfect place to start your fitness journey, to reignite it, to boost it further. I'm really, really proud of it. Really, really proud of it.

**Caleigh (Host):**
Well, I can see like the, the proud smile on your face for anyone who's listening right now. I see full teeth grin in this like beard of a face, this manly face. And like you said, it's so important to show emotions as a man, as a human being.

So thank you for being so vulnerable today on this episode and sharing your expertise and your insights around health, overall mental health, fitness, nutrition and just overall mindset as well.

So thank you and I hope listeners out there got some practical tips and advice that you can apply to your daily life. If you want to hear more, of course, check out the book because we're so proud of Ben. Thank you so much for being here.

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
Thank you so much Caleigh. Thank you.

**Ben Mudge (CF Person, Fitness Coach, Author):**
Ben, thank you so much for sharing your story and insights today. Your commitment to fitness and advocacy is a powerful example for the cystic fibrosis community to our listeners. You can connect with Ben and learn more about his work and book on social media at @benmudge_.

As we wrap up, I want to remind our listeners that your stories and engagement make this podcast a community driven space. Share your experiences with us on social media @fight2breathe or email me at caleigh@fight2breathe.org.

And a heartfelt thank you to the Cystic Fibrosis Foundation's Impact Grant for supporting this podcast.